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MSCTC to cut program offerings
Published Saturday, January 5, 2008
Dr. Ann Valentine
MSCTC-Fergus Falls will discontinue its criminal justice and medical laboratory technician (MLT) programs beginning this fall, with plans to stagger the start of its nursing degrees.
College administrators, state legislators and community members met on campus Friday to discuss not only upcoming program changes, but MSCTC’s financial health and its future in Fergus Falls.
“We’re in the vise fiscally,” said MSCTC President Dr. Ann Valen-tine, explaining that in 2007, the college received approximately $1,300 less from the state for each full time student than it received in 1999. With rising operating costs and a commitment to capping the tuition increase at 2 percent, the college has been forced to make cuts across its four campuses.
One of the causalities is the Fergus Falls criminal justice program, which has suffered from low enrollment in recent years. According Dr. Gary Henrickson, dean of academic affairs, only the introductory criminal justice course has been popular with Fergus Falls students.
“Then we fell way off to the point where we had five or six (students in the program),” he said, adding that the program may not continue in Moorhead, either, if enrollment doesn’t improve.
The introductory criminal justice course will still be offered in Fergus Falls next fall and local law enforcement will have access to the new Firearms Training Simulator, purchased by the college, the Sheriff’s departments of Clay and Otter Tail counties and the Moorhead and Fergus Falls police departments.
The Fergus Falls medical laboratory technician (MLT) program has also been discontinued — at least for now. Like criminal justice, it has been plagued by low enrollment.
“When you get to a certain (instructor/student) ratio,” said Chief Financial Officer Pat Nordick, “those programs don’t get enough revenue to pay their expenses.”
The college would need about $38,000 to continue the MLT program, Valentine said, money the college would make if more students were enrolled.
“The issue with MLT is not one of quality,” she said. “It’s fiscal.”
For people like Dr. Greg Smith, the MLT program is worth saving. Smith is the medical director of Lake Region Healthcare Corporation’s and Fergus Falls Medical Group’s laboratories, as well as the medical advisor to the MLT program.
“What I think we need is to reinstate this program immediately,” Smith said at Friday’s meeting.
“The program will never be large — and it never has been — but it plays a vital role.”
According to Smith, 80 percent of lab technicians with the Fergus Falls Medical Group and 18 of 25 Lake Region lab personnel are graduates of the MSCTC program, which is only offered in Fergus Falls.
On Friday, Smith joined with Gary Spies, owner of Service Food, and Sue Schatz, a medical technologist and assistant lab manager at Lake Region, to consider solutions to the MLT question — both short and long term. The group will meet to consider possible funding and recruitment options.
As it stands, current MLT students will continue in the program as planned, wrapping up their degrees in May 2009.
Though still available in Fergus Falls, the college’s nursing program will undergo significant changes beginning this fall. In Fergus Falls, the start of the licensed practical nursing (LPN) program will be delayed a semester, said Kathy Burlingame, associate dean of nursing. This means that instead of taking general education courses in the summer, followed by the start of the program in the fall, students will tackle general courses in the fall and start LPN training the following spring semester.
With low enrollment in LPN classes the past two years, Burlingame said, administrators hope delaying the intake of new students will fill classes later.
The start of the registered nurse (RN) program will rotate between three MSCTC campuses, also beginning fall 2008. At that time, Wadena will be the only campus offering first-year RN courses. In spring 2009, Detroit Lakes will be the site of these classes, followed by Fergus Falls in fall 2010. Current RN students will continue courses in Fergus Falls this fall, joined by students earning their Mobility Associate Degree (RN).
“What we’re essentially doing is ratcheting back to where we once were,” Valentine said, explaining that several factors contribute to the need to evaluate nursing options.
One is increased competition from other institutions in northwest Minnesota.
“Everybody has responded to the projected nursing shortages,” Burlingame said, including MSCTC.
“Students who, years ago, would have been turned down because of a higher GPA now are getting in.”
Yet fewer students are completing their programs. Roughly 45 percent of nursing students don’t finish their programs, and RN pass rates on exams through the Minnesota Board of Nursing are what Valentine called “a significant concern.”
A total of eight MSCTC faculty have been laid off, Valentine said. Four Fergus Falls instructors were laid off prior to Oct. 31, with one of the four lay offs still pending.
Comments
The Daily Journal is happy to host community conversations about news and life in Fergus Falls and the surrounding area. As hosts, we expect guests will show respect for each other. That means we don't threaten or defame each other, and we keep conversations free of personal attacks. Witty is great. Abusive is not. If you think a post violates these standards, don't escalate the situation. Instead, flag the comment to alert us. We'll take action if necessary. It's not hard. This should be a place where people want to read and contribute -- a place for spirited exchanges of opinion. So those who persist with racist, defamatory or abusive postings risk losing the privilege to post at all.Posted by jafo (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 9:14 a.m. (Suggest removal)
OK, here we go. What the heck is happening to OUR college?? The MLT program is an important, and successful program. Oh gee, if we just had $38,000, we could continue it??!! What!?? Serious??!! $7.5 million dollar construction project, and now the MLT program is gone for lack of $38k???
http://www.budget.state.mn.us/budget/cap...
http://media.www.thespartanonline.com/me...
Oh, but not to worry, in spring '08, the college will be offering a new astronomy class.
And, I hope someone here has some real numbers on the pass rates for the Board Exams from students at the Fergus Falls campus... Dr Valentine's statement of "significant concern" doesn't ring true to what I have heard.
Sounds to me like another example of how somebody (Valentine) can have multiple degrees, including a Master's, but somehow not have a lick of common sense. People of Fergus, you should be livid!!!
Posted by Lucky33 (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 10:35 a.m. (Suggest removal)
This is truly an atrocity, and I hope the Journal does a little more digging to get the real story here instead of just Dr. Valentine's take on it. From what I understand, the passing rate from the Fergus Falls campus has hovered around 90% or better for many years. However, FF isn't allowed to publicize those numbers. What MSCTC publicizes is the average passing rate among ALL the campuses, which is around 75%. (Someone please share the real numbers- I'm going off of memory and I know I'm off.). That means that the campuses who get to keep their programs have passing rates a LOT lower than Fergus. WTF?!?!? I have also heard that the Moorhead campus turned away about 60 students that didn't get in, but were given no information about the possibility of attending the Fergus campus instead. Further, the leaders of the bigger healthcare employers in Fergus Falls have attempted- graciously and at length- to work with Dr. Valentine, and have been met with stubbornness, sarcasm, and slammed down phones. Very professional, Dr. Valentine, but Fergus Falls is proud of their campus and need their nurses. And it's time you got off your high horse and start listening to people. I am a second-generation FFCC alumni and I have nothing but respect and admiration for the faculty at the Fergus Falls campus. 13 years later, I still remember a lot of what I learned- Thanks, Mrs. Pugh, Mr. Carney, Mr. Miltich, Mr. Nikolas, Mr. Daly, and all the other folks who helped me become the well-rounded, contributing member of the Fergus Falls community. You're doing exactly what we need you to do. I hope the administration of MSCTC starts showing you the respect you've earned.
Posted by Lucky33 (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 10:37 a.m. (Suggest removal)
One more thing... I can't take credit for this point, as it was made by someone else, but it's still a good one: How much does the football program cost? MSCTC doesn't seem to be sending a lot of guys to the NFL.
Posted by sassica (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 11:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I've heard there is a huge waiting list to get into the RN program in Fergus? Is this true?
Posted by American (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 7:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)
There is some very pathetic " stinking thinking," going on at the College. This type of thinking does not look forward it only regresses. I attended the JC many years ago and participated in several sports, somebody needs to look at how many people finished what they started. This is not to say that sports are unimportant, but there has been an awful lot of money put into athletics over the years. I believe that there are a significant number of students that are very concerned over the loss of the LPN program, for at least two years, due to the rotation in campuses. This will also put another unneeded financial burden on the students. It is more likely than not that this arrangement will only send those students to other Colleges. This situation is also quite evident in the loss of the MLT program.
If you look at the big picture, someone needs to start thinking outside the box, in other words, it's time for the community and the College to start to think " outside," the box. Surely in that mass of academic achievement, that is called the Faculty, someone can forsee a positive outcome to this travesty being perpetrated on thoses students and the community........or can they
Posted by Lucky33 (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 8:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)
“Students in our communities are interested in nursing careers. For the 2006 academic year, MSCTC had 850
applicants for 400 nursing program positions on the four campuses,” says Kathy Burlingame, MSCTC Interim
Associate Dean of Nursing.
This was taken verbatim out of the Annual Report published on the MSCTC website. Check it out- www.minnesota.edu.
SO WHAT IS THE ISSUE?!?!?!?!?
Posted by Lucky33 (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 8:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)
THIS WAS PUBLISHED ON OCTOBER 27, 2007 UNDER THE HEADLINE "NURSING PROGRAM SAFE AT MSCTC"
“Let me say with absolute certainty that we are not closing down nursing programs at any of our colleges,” Valentine said, addressing a rumor that had circulated this week. Current students, she said, can expect to complete their programs as planned.
http://www.fergusfallsjournal.com/news/2...
My, how quickly "absolute certainty" can change!
Posted by skatkat (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 9:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)
being a previous grad of msctc's mlt program, i was just wondering how we are supposed to help the lab shortage when our colleges are discontinuing the program?? i believe they should be out there promoting the program and trying to recruit more students instead of just shutting it down. i actually found out about the program by "accident." it is a wonderful profession, and the instructor works hard at what she does. mabye the shutdown is because lab professionals don't play sports....
Posted by KC (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 10:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Nursing schools in the twin cities areas are OVER FLOWING with students.... There are people on the waiting list for YEARS! Some of the problem may be that not very many people know that there is a nursing program here. I attended the University of Minnesota, Morris for 3 years before deciding I wanted to be a nurse. I applied to Alexandria tech in september 2007 and their LPN program for fall 2008 was already FULL with a waiting list!!! Where are those applicants going? I didn't know that Fergus Falls had a nursing program until a friend told me his sister graduated from here. I applied and the changes started happening. I was informed that there were hundreds of applicants for the nursing programs at the FF campus alone. Why the nursing programs would be staggered is beyond me. It makes me want to shake people and say "What the heck is your problem?" As for exam passing rates, I was told they were in the 90%s.... WHY AM I GOING TO ATTEND A SCHOOL FOR A PROGRAM WHOSE RATES ARE IN THE 70s????? I better get told the truth and quick, or I'm ganna have to start applying to different schools and looking for apartments..... again.....I know there is a lot of problems with the education in Minnesota, from grade school to colleges. I'm starting to get pissed off about all of it. I don't have kids, but I'm tired of strikes and program drops. I think sports are great, but if its going to start affecting enrollment because there is no money left for actual programs, I don't think they are that important. There are intramurals and you need to be serious, are you really playing as a means to live? No.... I hated the jocks in Morris. They acted like they were better and smarter than everyone... Turns out MOST were not as smart as they needed to be, and well the team was lucky to win a game.
Posted by ffprofessor (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 10:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Put yourself in the position of a new student, if I begin a course of study at Fergus Falls will I be able to continue in Fergus Falls or will I have to travel next year to Wadena or Moorhead or who knows where and for how long. This uncertainty is an impediment that hampers higher enrolment. Getting a commitment from the administration is worthless and can not be relied upon.
Posted by mnsotan (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 10:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I appreciated the opportunity to attend the LPN and the RN programs at FFCC (for me the name will never change). I no longer live in the area but read the news online each night. I encourage all of you who do live in county and have a stake in the success of the college to question and demand answers. If Valentine can be hired, she can be fired, but first you need answers and facts.
Posted by KC (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 10:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)
straight from the minnesota board of nursing website
http://www.state.mn.us/mn/externalDocs/N...
^^^pass rates for RN... average pass rate is 86.6%
http://www.state.mn.us/mn/externalDocs/N...
^^^pass rates for (L)PN... average pass rate is 89%
Those are fairly high in my opinion, they aren't the best they aren't the worst
Posted by chickadee (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 10:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)
"...RN pass rates on exams through the Minnesota Board of Nursing are what Valentine called “a significant concern.”
And Dr. Valentine, they should be and I agree with the comment Lucky33 posted - and know that the pass rates on a per-campus basis can be revealed. Any prospective student would be wise to ask the gradation rates AND the Board of Nursing exam pass rates for each campus. That is a truer measure of how healthy a nursing program is. The FF program has celebrated for many, many years excellent board passing rates - however since the merger of the tech colleges with our local community colleges, the board passing rates as a 4-campus "college" have dropped significantly. Yes, Dr. Valentine, THAT is a significant concern.
Fergus Falls and the surrounding communities can receive the correct information on what is happening at OUR campus in Fergus Falls. Lay off notices have been given to many of the Fergus faculty, including replacing a bachelors-prepared Registered Nurse faculty member with a one-year LPN who is in a position to "teach" - this occured a year or two ago and does the community know that? Replacing qualified faculty with less-experienced and less-qualified employees and worse yet, now to lay-off highly experienced, quality nursing leaders (as well as the others) in our community is a travesty!
Prior to the merging of the four campuses, there were anywhere between 100 and 200 applicants for 35 LPN positions on the FF campus each year. The best of the best were chosen, and the program produced and graduated top-notch nurses who are now taking care of all of us at the clinics, hospitals and nursing homes in our area.
However, once the merger took place, the "best" applicants (high GPA, previous experience in healthcare, etc) were basically divided amongst all four campuses - and the remaining applicants who previously would have not met the high admission standards of FF, now were placed in nursing classrooms on all campuses to fill spots. The admission criteria and those students chosen for the FF campus was no longer a local decision by local faculty, it was "centralized" after the merge.
It is not to say that every high GPA student becomes the best nurse, that is not always the case but admitting students who would have previously not met the admission standards FF demanded, does change program outcomes.
Would that affect the "numbers" Dr. Valentine was referring to? Of course, it doesn't take a master's degree, PhD or anything else besides common sense to see our local campus is getting lost in MSCTC. Programs which FF was known for, nursing and MLT for example, are disappearing or at best, being watered down. THAT is what affects the quality, the performance of students and the board passing rates.
Fergus Falls and area communities: Stand up for YOUR campus! Contact Senator Skogen or Representative Nornes with your concerns.
Posted by Lucky33 (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 10:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)
KC- Thanks for the links. I was looking for this information, but couldn't find it.
What's interesting is the Fergus LPN program had 100% pass in 2003, 100% in 2004, 96% in 2005, and then once they averaged all the campuses together, it dropped to 85% the next year. Which campus is dragging down the average, and why aren't they being forced to defend their program?
Posted by chickadee (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 11:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)
THAT is what people should be looking into! Thank you Lucky33!
Posted by Lucky33 (anonymous) on January 5, 2008 at 11:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)
So what do you suppose is going to happen to the $75k crime simulator they just got for the criminal justice program they just cut? Who paid for it, the college or the county? Do you think we can put it on EBay and at least get the MLT program back? How about the $38k Sim Man they just got for the nursing program? I'll bet the Lake Region Hospital Foundation is thrilled they donated to it, and then found out nursing was being cut. How about all the families who have donated to the Fergus Falls College Foundation to support nursing scholarships? (I'm thinking specifically of the LaPlante scholarship) Are they going to be supporting nursing students in Wadena now? Dr. Valentine is pissing people off in a big way, and she hasn't been very forthcoming with evidence to support their decision on this. She's obviously intimidated the bejeezus out of the faculty, but she can't stare down all the people in Fergus Falls and Otter Tail County who have supported this school for the last 30-odd years.
Posted by jafo (anonymous) on January 6, 2008 at 10:49 a.m. (Suggest removal)
This is from the MSCTC website...
http://www.minnesota.edu/faq/index.php?f...
"The Fergus Falls campus is primarily a transfer institution, preparing students in general education for transfer to a four-year college or university... It is very common to be undecided while attending the Fergus Falls campus."
It's obvious from those statements that they don't want any specific programs on our campus, at all... just the basics, then move on.
When asked what our area students were supposed to do for a nursing/MLT program if they weren't going to be available here, the answer given was "they can go to a college."
We need our FFCC back.
Posted by Escapee (anonymous) on January 6, 2008 at 5:33 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Look for this in the editorial column:
Deep down in places people don’t talk about at parties, it’s there: Fergus Falls Community College has been eaten alive by a big ugly monster – MSCTC.
Surely you’ve noticed…. (just check the comments on the Journal’s web site!). Saturday’s lead story is just an example. Programs are being cut. Instructors are being laid off. All in “recent” years.
IT IS NOT A COINCIDENCE!
Fergus Falls Community College had its niche in the collegiate marketplace, offering an Associate degree, solid and respected transfer curriculum, and a student life program rich with championship sports teams, an active student body, and (though overlooked in the Journal’s coverage of the termination of The Spartan) an award-winning student newspaper.
Where did all the students go? Moorhead, Detroit Lakes and Wadena. Why leave home when you can get what you want in your own backyard? Case in point: Prior to the four-campus merger, Northwest Technical College (with campuses in Moorhead, Detroit Lakes and Wadena) offered only terminal programming and lacked the curriculum and quality instructors necessary for transferable liberal arts programming. After the merger, the Fergus Falls campus and its instructors were forced to share its curriculum AND its Associate degree with its new “partners.”
While it seemed the Fergus Falls campus would survive with a dedicated local administration, that seems to have been eaten up as well. Chewed up and spit out by a new president, an exodus of administrators was only the precursor to the problems the Fergus campus faces today.
Where did all the administrators go? It may work best to use an analogy here – especially for you Harry Potter fans having read or seen Order of the Phoenix. In this fifth book of the series, Hogwart’s School of Witchcraft and Wizardry is invaded by Delores Umbridge, a short, squat woman with a Napoleon complex, who takes over the school without the mission of the institution on her agenda. Professors are upset. Soon the school’s headmaster, Professor Dumbledore, is outed and the school spirals out of control.
Something needs to be done. Perhaps MSCTC-Fergus Falls can cede from the union and regain its true identity. If not, the next question may be “Where did the college go?”
Posted by ginger_ale (anonymous) on January 7, 2008 at 9:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Part I of II:
I believe it would be prudent to have somebody publish the board passing rates for each campus individually. I believe that would prove to everyone how ridiculous this decision is. The news that I have heard regarding the recent RN grads at Wadena is that a lot of them failed. I have not heard of any Fergus Falls students that failed their boards. Again, all of the information that I have is word of mouth from former nursing students. If what I have heard is true, why is Wadena receiving the program?
As a former student, I know that there were hundreds of candidates that filled out applications every year. Why offer only one program at a time? How does this benefit the college? Why lay off nursing faculty at the Fergus Falls campus if they have the highest board passing rates? What is going on?
Things are simply not adding up, and our campus is paying a tremendous price for decisions that have been made by people who have been nothing but disloyal to the Fergus Falls community. We need our college; it has been a staple of our community for over forty years.
The community should be mad as heck. There is a significant number of students who attend the college with thought of entering the nursing field. Many of them do become accepted to the program, but for those who don't, they still continue on to complete degrees. Without a nursing program every year, who is going to be taking A&P, Chemistry, Microbiology, Developmental Psyc, College Writing, and all of the other prerequisite classes that are offered? We heard a while back that the nursing program was safe and that no programs were going to be cut and now all of a sudden the MLT, Criminal Justice, and Nursing programs will cease to exist as they have been at the college for decades.
Posted by ginger_ale (anonymous) on January 7, 2008 at 9:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Part II of II
I can assure anyone who is reading this, that the moment Kathy Burlingame became the dean of the nursing program the program began to suffer. Decisions that were made within the program began to follow a striking pattern – whatever was easiest for Kathy.
The 2nd year of our program, we lost a lab faculty person who was vital to the success of our first year. This position was filled by a LPN (who did a wonderful job), however was not as qualified to offer the experience and nurture the assessment strategies required by an RN. We were constantly told to "Trust" the decisions that were begin made, yet every decision that was made was not in our favor. Amazingly, when our loyal faculty member applied for the labtech position (which would have been a significant decrease in wages), she was not hired - A FORMER FACULTY MEMBER WITH A BACHELORS DEGREE AND TONS OF EXPERIENCE WAS NOT HIRED! Was that decision made in the best interest of the students, or did somebody have an agenda?
She nearly prevented a number of mobility students from entering the program. When confronted with concerns from students she tried to pit us (the students) against our teachers. There were also moments, when unable to answer our concerns, that she resorted to the use of intimidation.
Making things worse, is that her close relationship with Dr. Valentine ensures that anything she says goes... Actually, as a student, I never once saw Dr. Valentine visit any of our classes or our nursing lab, yet she was able to make tremendous cuts that impacted the quality of our program.
Why do I care? I love the college. When I was a student at FFCC/MSCTC, I felt that I was a member of a strong community. I always knew that administrative decisions were made with the students' best interest in mind. That philosophy of putting the student first was evident during interactions with instructors, counselors, librarians, custodians, housing staff, multicultural student services, the bookstore, student services, the business office, media specialists, coaches, and administration. Unfortunately, that culture is dying. Something needs to happen.
Posted by ginger_ale (anonymous) on January 8, 2008 at 2:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Part II:
The 2nd year of our program, we lost a lab faculty person who was vital to the success of our first year. This position was filled by a LPN (who did a wonderful job), however was not as qualified to offer the experience and nurture the assessment strategies required by an RN. We were constantly told to "Trust" the decisions that were begin made, yet every decision that was made was not in our favor. Amazingly, when our loyal faculty member applied for the labtech position (which would have been a significant decrease in wages), she was not hired - A FORMER FACULTY MEMBER WITH A BACHELORS DEGREE AND TONS OF EXPERIENCE WAS NOT HIRED! Was that decision made in the best interest of the students, or did somebody have an agenda?
She nearly prevented a number of mobility students from entering the program. When confronted with concerns from students she tried to pit us (the students) against our teachers. There were also moments, when unable to answer our concerns, that she resorted to the use of intimidation.
Making things worse, is that her close relationship with Dr. Valentine ensures that anything she says goes... Actually, as a student, I never once saw Dr. Valentine visit any of our classes or our nursing lab, yet she was able to make tremendous cuts that impacted the quality of our program.
Why do I care? I love the college. When I was a student at FFCC/MSCTC, I felt that I was a member of a strong community. I always knew that administrative decisions were made with the students' best interest in mind. That philosophy of putting the student first was evident during interactions with instructors, counselors, librarians, custodians, housing staff, multicultural student services, the bookstore, student services, the business office, media specialists, coaches, and administration. Unfortunately, that culture is dying. Something needs to happen.
Posted by ginger_ale (anonymous) on January 8, 2008 at 2:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)
The following comment will take place in two parts. I have more than 3000 characters. It begins below:
I believe it would be prudent to have somebody publish the board passing rates for each campus individually. I believe that would prove to everyone how ridiculous this decision is. The news that I have heard regarding the recent RN grads at Wadena is that a lot of them failed. I have not heard of any Fergus Falls students that failed their boards. Again, all of the information that I have is word of mouth from former nursing students. If what I have heard is true, why is Wadena receiving the program?
As a former student, I know that there were hundreds of candidates that filled out applications every year. Why offer only one program at a time? How does this benefit the college? Why lay off nursing faculty at the Fergus Falls campus if they have the highest board passing rates? What is going on?
Things are simply not adding up, and our campus is paying a tremendous price for decisions that have been made by people who have been nothing but disloyal to the Fergus Falls community. We need our college; it has been a staple of our community for over forty years.
The community should be mad as hell. There is a significant number of students who attend the college with thought of entering the nursing field. Many of them do become accepted to the program, but for those who don't, they still continue on to complete degrees. Without a nursing program every year, who is going to be taking A&P, Chemistry, Microbiology, Developmental Psyc, College Writing, and all of the other prerequisite classes that are offered? We heard a while back that the nursing program was safe and that no programs were going to be cut and now all of a sudden the MLT, Criminal Justice, and Nursing programs will cease to exist as they have been at the college for decades.
I can assure anyone who is reading this, that the moment Kathy Burlingame became the dean of the nursing program the program began to suffer. Decisions that were made within the program began to follow a striking pattern – whatever was easiest for Kathy.
Posted by olson736 (anonymous) on January 8, 2008 at 8:37 p.m. (Suggest removal)
A recent article in the Fargo Forum dated October 28th the day after Valentine's article appeared. Talked about how many students were turned away at the area colleges wishing to take nursing. There seems to be a disconnect between Valentines management and the other colleges. For her to talk about less funding but yet compares it to funds from 1999 to 2007 doesn't make any sense. Lets look at the funding from 3 years ago when she got here and last year to see if there is a significant difference. Funding is based on number of students, lack of students is the problem or helping them be successful in school to keep them is school is the key.
I here the folks developing the RTC are setting up a program to bring 40+ students into the nursing program. This sure is a win win for our area and helps solve problems at the MSCTC also. I hope they are successful in their efforts but I am sure Valentine will try sabotage that also.
Posted by news2me (anonymous) on January 9, 2008 at 11 p.m. (Suggest removal)
All of you bloggers are single handingly tearing down the college with each word you write - so a big congratulations to you! Soon you can spout off on how there are no students due to bad press and they shut down the college. Shut your mouths, if you had any common sense at all you would realize there is a college within a 50 mile radius of FF in every direction competing for the same students, keep your bad mouthing up and you will effectively turn students and parents away - oh wait I guess I am confused is that your intention or is it to shred what little dignty you have left by bad mouthing Dr. Valentine?
Posted by Escapee (anonymous) on January 10, 2008 at 10:01 a.m. (Suggest removal)
news2me -- yes, colleges within a 50 mile radius that could compete are the Moorhead, Wadena and Detroit Lakes campuses, which wouldn't stand a chance of competing as technical colleges against our FFCC. That's the problem. It started with the merger. The addition of a tech-oriented leader has just made things worse.
Note that we are not bad-mouthing the college, or its instructors. Everyone who has commented has gret things to say about the nursing program. Some have commented about the dedication of instructors.
Our intent is to raise awareness that something's going on -- to save the college. To get back OUR college.
Sometimes the truth makes us uncomfortable, but it's time for a wake-up call.
Posted by bucksteel (anonymous) on January 10, 2008 at 10:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)
It's time for Dr Valentine to leave, before she does more damage to the local college.
Posted by jafo (anonymous) on January 10, 2008 at 1:26 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Hey news2me... the college is being damaged all right, but not from a few people writing about it. Important programs are being cut, good educators are leaving, test score information is being misrepresented. That is the reality. So, we are all supposed to just "shut up", and let it continue??? Here's a tip for you... when you have your head buried in the sand, you are wide open for a kick in the pants.
Posted by news2me (anonymous) on January 11, 2008 at 1:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)
First of all there are more colleges within a 50 mile radius of FF than just Moorhead, Wadena, and DL. NDSCS, Alexandria Technical College, as well as Rasmussen College building a new college in the FM area, plus you have NDSU, MSUM etc.
Secondly Dr. Ann Valentine did not cause nor approve the merger, this was done by her predecessor before she ever stepped foot on the campus. MnSCU initiated mergers all over the state of MN, currently there is about a handful of stand alone 2 year colleges in MN. ALL the technical colleges in MN are competing to get AA degree's on their campuses, and many of them are succeding, therefore had FFCC not merged they probably would have felt the effects anyway. MnSCU would have to approve a de-merger which I believe is very, very doubtful.
To you jafo if I had my head in the sand I wouldn't have the correct facts - which you clearly do not. If you had a lick of sense you would know that money spent on the building project cannot - I repeat cannot be allocated to save a program.
Posted by Lucky33 (anonymous) on January 11, 2008 at 2:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)
news2me- are you really suggesting that when the community sees a valuable, necessary program circling the drain, we should just shut up and let it happen? You're probably right that Dr. Valentine didn't get us into this merger, but she is responsible for everything that has happened since. If there is misinformation being circulated, I'd certainly like to hear the real story. But to the best of my knowledge, Dr. Valentine and Ms. Burlingame haven't been very forthcoming or honest with the information they choose to share with the community.
Posted by renegade (anonymous) on January 11, 2008 at 3:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)
news2me -- information is really the key. Check out these links:
http://www.mnscu.edu/media/newsreleases/...
http://www.mnscu.edu/media/newsreleases/...
http://www.mnscu.edu/campuses/alpha.html...
You'll find that a lot of mergers took place after MnSCU formed. Generally, the consolidation process resulted in the merger of one tech campus and one community college within the same community. In some instances the consolidation involved two communities. Only one (in addition to MSCTC) involved more than two communities - Minnesota West Community and Technical Colleges, which included five communities, all significantly smaller than those involved here (perhaps with the exception of Wadena). None of the other mergers involved such an imbalance of representation between tech and community colleges.
Just because one entity wants something (tech campus - AA degree) doesn't mean another (FFCC) should bend over backwards, to its own detriment, to give it to the other. (Exaggerated example: Gosh, the government is going to end up with all my money, why don't I just a write check for the whole darn thing right now?)
I agree with the editorial in yesterday's paper - FFCC was gobbled up by MSCTC.
Posted by jafo (anonymous) on January 11, 2008 at 11:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I understand the construction money is separate from program funding. The perception is, however, that something is wrong when money like that is pumped into a facility, and then programs are cut. I didn't think I had to explain that.
The point is that the college has problems, real problems, and people feel strongly about it. That is the reality, and NOT talking about it sure isn't going to solve anything.
Posted by IDCanymore (anonymous) on January 13, 2008 at 3:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Please be sure that we are also referencing correct facts when "blame" is put on to the technical campuses. You should realize and understand the instructors from those campuses did NOT have a choice in the merger either.(It was done to them - despite their opposition) However, all instructors from all 4 campuses have worked very hard to build unity and a sense of community to all campuses. The instructors from the technical campuses are extremely well educated, professional, and high quality instructors. If enrollment has dropped, you need to look at the facts of why, but do not look to the instructors at ANY of the campuses - they have all worked extremely hard in making this work. If the instructors can respect one another from their sister campuses, then I am sure the rest of you can as well.
Posted by jafo (anonymous) on January 13, 2008 at 7:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Just going by the numbers, pass rates are lower at the Tech Schools than what the FFCC has consistently shown. It is what it is.
So, just curious now, if the Tech Schools were against the merger, and the FFCC wasn't for it... why did it happen??
Posted by IDCanymore (anonymous) on January 15, 2008 at 12:10 p.m. (Suggest removal)
jafo, can you please site what those historic pass rates were for both the Fergus campus and the other campuses? Can you give the exact rates say for the past 5 years? And then possibly direct us to the source that you site. It would be really helpul to know the statistics, as you have stated that the other campuses within the college have had lower pass rates.
The answer to your question about the merger would have to be answered by MNSCU system office. It was at that level, along with the Board of Trustees that made the final decision.
Posted by chickadee (anonymous) on January 19, 2008 at 10:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)
IDCanymore: why don't you ask Ann Valentine or Kathy Burlingame (Dean of Nursing) - it would be their jobs to give those exact answers. I would be surprised if they actually answered that question. However, ALL the nursing faculty from ALL campuses know the pass-rate results...Let's let accountability rest where it should, on administration.
Posted by KC (anonymous) on January 22, 2008 at 2:34 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I went in to chat with an admissions counselor about whether or not the nursing program that I want to go into would be cut. I mentioned this article and she got pissed off. we discussed the merger and A LOT of faculty at the FF campus were not for it. I understand that they didn't have a say in the matter. BUT if you go up to the first couple of posts you can find the PN scores from the MN board of nursing websites. The RN are also listed, but you can't find them individually.... again the admissions counselor I talked to said the passing rate for PN in FF was about 90%.... She also said the Moorhead campus was only at about 67%... the rates aren’t bad here... If people knew how hard those tests actually were, they would feel differently. It isn't on the instructors alone... The student has to study for these tests... I don't know how they compare to the EMT-B tests, but all that was said to me was study, they are really hard.... When I got there, I was fairly well prepared for it and I'm grateful for that. I don't know about you, but I don't want people caring for me who aren't capable of the job.... Some people don't know what they want to do when they first go into the program... I attended another college for 3 years before I finally decided on nursing here.... I had 7 different majors, and 3 minors listed before I decided on nursing. You have to expect that. I still don't know exactly what I want to do.... I interned with a certified nurse practitioner/midwife..... that is my dream job I’ve decided... so when I'm done with my 4 year RN I’ll maybe do that.... look at how many majors I switched around to in just 3 years. I could be the majors/minors catalogue for crimminy's sake.... Some people don't have good grades in high school because it’s not what they like. I was always good at my biology classes in high school.... but when it got to more specifics in college, I saw that the medical classes were way easier for me.... I never had to study for them, because they came so easily. Give me a historical date and it’s gone in 5 seconds. I don't know the selection process exactly for nursing here... but in Alex, they select people for interviews... my guess is they want to see who can do it.... their fall 2008 roster was set in November.
People need to look elsewhere before looking at a newspaper.... clearly newspapers can be biased and have alternative agendas.... I talked to people at the college, got some questions answered, saw this article, and bam went straight to those people again... I was reassured.
I can also understand that yes this might scare some people off.... They want to know that the program that they are looking into is going to be safe until they finish it.... if it looks a little shaky; they tend to run away from it.... This article itself makes the nursing program look shaky, and made me second guess my decision to come here.... it wasn't the people posting comments
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